The state of brands in gaming & virtual worlds in 2025

This transcript was generated from the session recording and lightly edited for readability.

Here we are. Right. So, welcome to the webinar and welcome our participants who are already joining. we’re going to start. I’m very happy to share with you all that this is our latest report that we’ve just released, which is the state of brands in gaming and virtual worlds, part four. this is our fourth report, one that takes a lot of the data that we have here at GEEQ, looking at all of the activations that have happened in virtual worlds.

The last one we did was in the summer of 2024. And this one includes more data right the way through to the end of 2024, and it’s a real look of what happened last year, which should inform what’s going to happen this year. I’m also very happy to announce, for the first time at GEEQ, typically, we’ve been looking at virtual environments in terms of owned worlds and integrations. We are now adding another data point into GEEQ, which is items. And items, for the first time, are included in this report.

So, all of you that have joined, thank you for joining. You will be getting a full copy of this report, not a physical one, a digital one, but it will be sent to you after this. Now, I am delighted to be joined by our partnerships and insights director, Alban, or head of partnerships and insights, I could say. and the first thing Alban said to me before we joined the webinar is, “I’m worried about what you’re going to be asking me, Charles.” So, the what are you worried about, Alban? What are you concerned about?

I think no, I don’t I’m I’m I’m excited to see what type of question you’re going to grill me with, and then I have everyone for witness that I will go quite politician on you if I don’t know the answer. I will just ask you what you think first.

Well, why don’t we just start by talking about some of the things that we’ve seen or the top-level data points that we’ve seen and I’m going to just share my screen so that everyone on the call can see and understand. Are you able to see this Al Ban? I just want to check that everyone else is seeing it.

So, from a top-level perspective, there were 558 brands that launched new activations in virtual worlds. That’s a 10% growth on the previous year, 2023. 880 brands brand activations took place in virtual worlds. That’s a 38% increase.

and 370 brands activated in virtual worlds for the first time ever, which is a 6% increase. And I think there’s a stat here which really astounds me and I it’s important for everyone to know this is that 52% over half of all brands that have entered virtual worlds did so last year. So, that’s really amazing and Geek has been tracking this this these sort of activations since 2018. Over half of the brands that have activated since that point did it in 1 year and it was that that last year. So, my first question to you Al Ban is what do you think is the key stat out of all the stats that you can see here that you would like to pick up on and that you think is is interesting and and why do you think that is?

I think this this this two things. The The first one you you’re right. I think what was quite astonishing and even for for me looking back was the the pure volume, I guess, of activation that we saw last year and brands that we hadn’t seen activating in the space. but most importantly, and I think something that always really excites me is the ratio of number of unique brands and number of activations in the space, which kind of goes to the to the

Meaning that essentially what what we’ve seen is that you have over 500 brands that have activated. So new brands that have activated but 800 plus activations, meaning that for one brand you at least have I think it if again, sorry if my math is not right, but it’s like 1.6 on average activation. So it’s it’s quite interesting to see that brands are not doing just one activations inside these virtual environments. And it could be that they have, a really like detailed roadmap for one specific platform like Coach that did two activations on Roblox specifically. or it could be that they’re doing it in like several platforms throughout the year.

So I think it’s really exciting. I think you and I and the whole business we’ve always seen these platforms as social media platform and and a new form of social media. And it really goes to show that brands are essentially doubling down on what platforms they’re going into but how many times as well they’re going into, whether it’s by having several activations, whether it’s having an owned world, but then having integrations to traffic to their own world. So it’s really exciting to see, I think, the one yes, the number of new brands are going to the space, but most importantly the number of activations that they’re doing.

Yeah, I think well, that’s a great point you raised. I think absolutely we kind of this is what we thought would happen or our thesis was these UGC gaming platforms are an evolution of social media. Brands in social media don’t just activate on Instagram, they also activate on TikTok and Facebook and Snapchat and other social media channels. The key thing is there were 500 brands that 500 odd brands that went in last year, but the really interesting point you bring up is over 800 activations. And do you think this is down to this rise of the cross-platform approach in the same way these brands have a cross-platform approach in social media?

Because we know that integrations are something that’s happening [clears throat] and we can talk a little bit about that where a brand will do multiple activations in one platform.

You know, who is it? Is it Walmart that’s done Roblox, Zepeto, and Imperia? As you mentioned, Coach going into Roblox and Zepeto doing an integration strategy with both.

I I think it is this two thing. I think when we when first is is I guess the definition of brand activation. So, within brand activation, within that 800 number, we do integrate, number of integrations. So, a brand that goes inside an existing an existing environment, take it as I guess the equivalent of an influencer marketing, but within these these new platforms. And also a brand that’s launching their new like Instagram page, but that’s their Roblox page or their Fortnite island.

So, I think what what we’re seeing here is like yes, you’re right where some brands are diversifying. So, they are launching on Roblox as well as Zepeto as well as as well as Fortnite. But I think what we’re seeing more and more is probably brands that are betting on one specific platform and I’m doing more integration as well throughout the year on that one specific platform. So, a little bit like they first launched their owned experience, but they also then starts growing that community by doing more and more integrations. The same way as you would launch your Instagram page, but then you do a huge influencer marketing campaign to like loop it back to your initial like owned owned channel.

So, I think it’s it’s a little bit of both, but I would say that I’m seeing two types of strategy. Like some is just about owning the community and they want to own the community on multiple platforms. Others, it’s more about harnessing that one specific community and really doubling down on the effort of essentially expanding their reach having more integrations. So, we’re seeing two strategies, not like I guess it really depends again on is is, Zepeto the only audience that you want to reach, therefore doubling down on that one platform makes sense, or is it more about having like several touch points and marketing touch points so that you can start owning that community. So, it really depends I think of what is the initial strategy of the brand.

So, I would say that like neither is good or bad, it just really depends on what was the initial like strategy of the brand.

Yeah, and what do you make of this then? So, where does this strategy sit in that place?

So, this I think it’s like a really interesting and it’s something that we’ve seen in the past. I think Gucci has done very similar very similar model where this is more a campaign moment where, there’s a there’s a really big, I guess, marketing moment for the brand and a huge campaign that’s going to be distributed across several marketing channel, and Zepeto and Roblox are two channels that also needs to be accounted for to reach the audience of Coach. So, when when their new campaign has launched, obviously they they had their like traditional social media platform, as well as Zepeto and two integrations within Roblox, but here it’s again more of a campaign approach as opposed to owning they they didn’t launch their own environments within within Roblox. What they did is identify key experiences that had their target audience that they can do a collaboration here. So it was more about I guess distribution distributing sorry that the content around around the campaign in several several social media platform out of which are immersive social media platform like Zepeto and Roblox.

Yeah, I mean I I think I mean I agree with you. I think it’s just they are looking at Zepeto’s and Roblox as an extension of their wider campaign strategy.

And it just so happens that in Zepeto and Roblox they are able to reach a community which they can’t reach on traditional social media and actually the engagement they get back from the immersive platforms is far greater than the engagement they’re getting back from these traditional social media channels. I just want to ask you a little bit about the platforms themselves. I mean Roblox continues to dominate our band, but is there anything in the report that tells us about some of the other platforms that are out there? For those listening, what was the movements and changes we saw in 2024 and what should we sort of expect for 2025 in terms of the dominance of of the Roblox being the dominating platform then obviously Fortnite. but tell us a bit about what happened in 24 and what we should expect for 25.

Yeah, I think there’s there’s this overall I think if we if we take a step back even before we we look at obviously the the dominant platform within that within that model, but I think we are seeing more and more traditional developers going more towards a UGC model. So, that would be that would be essentially a a the similar way that we have for like Instagram or other social media platform where the the the platform is essentially the host, but the content is built by the community. there’s rumors at the moment that potentially Rockstar with GTA is going to follow a similar model. So, this is something that we’re seeing I guess a structure that more developers are are taking and obviously Roblox has always been that’s always been their model, which is having more the content created by by the community. And I think what’s really interesting what they’re doing is really aligning with the capabilities of social media platform where essentially if if you think about Roblox and now Zepeto, which is the other new player on on that side, it’s they are providing marketers a very similar solution as social media where yes, it it really is not about reinventing the wheel here.

It’s more about adapting your social media strategy to these new social media platforms where you can do paid, you can owned obviously your channel by having your own environment and having your owned content, but you can also do influencer marketing aka integration. and now what’s really exciting is that in Roblox that was released last year, but this year is Zepeto also launched direct response. So, you are essentially able to people are able to discover your brand through these virtual environments, but there and then purchase as well the product. And I think this is something that social media platform have done in the past, and this is now something that we’re seeing from Roblox already, but now Zepeto where not only can people start discovering your brand as you mentioned Charles, these are people for some of that are not on on platforms. So, they might actually discover your brand on the platform or on Roblox.

And the ability to engage with them in a much more immersive way, it’s it’s such an opportunity for brands, but now they actually can convert in that same space as opposed to having a, needing for the user to come out of the platform and go into your e-commerce or like your retailers. I think the opportunity here is that you can start attributing the engagement of of those users directly into like a bottom funnel conversion.

And I want to ask you a final question, which I’m actually going to leave to you, Alban.

What is it we’ve got the audience here. what is it that you feel that I should be asking the brands in terms of what their strategy should be for 2025?

I’m I’m curious on two things. I guess I’m curious initially in the in the journey, like how do they perceive these platforms? Is it still like separate to their like other social media activities or fully integrated it? And I think understanding as well like the teams behind them will be quite interesting. and I think when it comes to strategies, I’m curious to see what is their objective. Are we still looking at more campaign focused maybe when it’s more of a, products campaign or is it more about owning and growing their community, in which case maybe owner is more something that they’re that they’re trying to explore.

I’ll be interested to see, I think understand how they are building their strategy, but what is the objective initially behind that strategy? Is it more like campaign focused ad hoc at specific moment of the brand or is this more about harnessing a new a new community around the brand it through a media that’s a lot more immersive?

Yeah. Okay. Well, I’ll ask them and we’ll see what they say.

I think that I think that’s a good question. The big reason is why has why changed? Why did you go in in 2022 if you’re talking to a brand to why you’re going in in 2025? It’s why you’re continuing to stay in. And I think that why has changed over time.

Yeah. Let’s see. Alban, thank you so much for your time as I know how busy and how much work, you’re doing an incredible job. So, keep keep it up and I’m sure we’ll speak again on the next state of virtual worlds and gaming. So, thank you, Albon. And now I’m going to turn it to our fantastic marketing team behind the scenes who are going to be inviting in our brands. Then we’ve got some really great brands, three really really great brands to to to speak with you today.

one of them is Rory who’s just joined who is part of Rocket Entertainment and I’ll let Rory introduce himself. I’ll let them all introduce themselves. We’ve also got Dan Daniel from Amnesty International and we’ve got Sarah from Cosanova. So, firstly, thank you all so much for joining me. you’ve all had a look at the report. The first thing I’m going to do is I’m going to turn it to you guys to introduce yourself.

One, say what you do and and where you work and then a little bit of background in terms of what you’ve done in virtual worlds. and then I’ll go into the very easy {slash} very difficult questions. So, Rory, why don’t you kick us off?

Sure. thank you so much for having me, by by way. so, yeah, I’m Rory Easton done. I’m head of digital at Rocket Entertainment. So, we are responsible for Elton John. And back in 2022, we launched Elton John’s Beyond the Yellow Brick Road to celebrate his final North American tour show at Dodger Stadium. So, we had a whole month-long experience that we launched. Games where people could dance along to Elton songs, a dozen or more items inspired by Elton’s wardrobe, all leading up to a final concert that played the final weekend of Elton’s Dodger Stadium show, which was a lot of fun.

And so, yeah, I look forward to diving into it more, but I’ll hand over.

Thanks, Rory. excited for you to have to excited for you to be here. Sara, why don’t you introduce yourself and tell us a bit about where you work and and what you’ve done.

Hello, everyone. so, yeah, my name is Sara Passa and I work for Cosnova. And right now, I’m a digital brand experience manager and I’m responsible for the Kingdom of Estancia, that is our Roblox experience. We We launched 3 months ago, a little bit less.

Oh, Sara, I think Sara’s frozen. We’ll give her Sara a minute. I think what Sara was meaning to say is she’s launched an incredible experience. We’ll wait for Sara to come back in. Daniel, why don’t you take over? Oh, wait, we got Sara back. Sara, can you hear us?

Yes, yeah, we lost you for a second. Carry on.

Yeah, so I was just mentioning that previously in 2023, the brand had a an experience. Then yeah, I I have some technical problems, I think so.

We can see you and hear you, so just keep going.

Oh, yeah. Okay. So, that was in 2023. It was for a campaign, and then now we have launched Kingdom of Essentia back in the end of November. So, yeah, we had not a long run, but I would say the first year with a lot of achievements and challenges as well.

Oh, it’s a great success. I can see it’s already over 4 million visits, so huge congratulations to Daniel. Why don’t you introduce yourself and and tell us a bit about what you’ve done?

Yes. Thank you, Charles. Daniel Gamboa, and I work as director of growth in the Argentinian section of Amnesty International. And this was a new project for us that we started in 2023. And we launched last year also one of those brands that it started with a project in 2024. And this is a video game that Amnesty created portraying the the the journey of a refugee that is trying to get to a safe place. It’s a survival game directed to trying to reach more younger audiences that Amnesty International usually gets.

And that’s really interesting and a challenge also for us since we are not a big I don’t know big gaming company or anything. It was everything new and interesting strategy for

Thank you so much, Daniel, and many congratulations on your your experience. So, I’ve just spoken to Aruban, and I went through some of the top stats that we’ve seen in the report, and much of it was last year was the biggest year we saw in terms of the number of brands activating. Over over half of all brands that have activated in virtual worlds did so last year. And we’ve been tracking this since 2018. So, we’re seeing no slowdown in terms of brands investing in the space.

We’re definitely seeing the why change in terms of why they’re activating. So, I’m going to take I’m going to ask Rory this first in terms of the why because I know that Elton John activated in Was it 2023 or 2024?

22. So, super, that’s that’s sort of ancient in terms of virtual brands entering virtual worlds space. So, why don’t you talk to a little bit about the why? So, why is it that Elton John activated in in in in a platform like Roblox?

So, I think there was a real moment for Elton with his final, his Farewell Yellow Brick Road tour was coming to an end in North America. You know, he was not only ending that tour, but 50 years of one of like the greatest touring legacies that, world’s ever seen. And it was very much the creative vision of Elton and David Furnish for us to celebrate that moment in every way that we could. And I think they saw how much joy Roblox and gaming was bringing their kids and just thought that that would be such an amazing way to celebrate his final show by not only having him perform on stage, back at Dodger Stadium. The last time he performed there was 1975 for the first iconic show, but be back there and perform at Dodger Stadium and also be performing in the metaverse.

And yeah, Elton’s always been forward-looking. We’ve always been looking for new and exciting things to do and it just felt like the next frontier and a really exciting way for us to celebrate that end of an incredible legacy. So, it was that moment, but I think we were excited for Elton to reach a new audience, we knew that there was an active, engaged, excited audience that we of young people, and we’ve had a really thorough social media strategy in making sure that we’re reach reaching younger demographics and create, yeah, continuing Elton’s music legacy for new generations. And I think this felt like a new way that we could go direct to a an even younger generation than we’re seeing maybe on TikTok or more like your YouTube Shorts audience. And go to them where they were with something that, would speak to them directly.

Or authentically resonated with that particular audience. It was really just such an incredible activation, so huge congratulations on that. Daniel, I suppose the why the why would be good to understand because now, push forward a couple years, this Was it 2024 when you activated or 2023? 24. Yeah. Can you Can you give us an idea of the reasons why Amnesty was going in to a platform like Roblox to to to activate?

Yes, in our case it was a strategical move and what we’re seeing is that the of course we’re in a different sector than most of you. We’re in the human rights sector and human rights there is an anti-rights narrative that is surging within younger generations and it has been very difficult for Amnesty to get younger generations and that is where the big debates of ideas is happening right now. And we needed to, just as Rory was saying, to get to where they are. And they are there. And for us, for example, as Amnesty it’s very difficult to reach certain markets, for example, Russia.

It’s a very difficult market for us, a market where human rights narratives are, needed. And through this video again we managed to go over those limits and reach new markets and new people that was not getting the human rights narrative that we are trying to promote around the world. So, it was a challenge in a strategic in a strategic decision, but it’s a difficult one and I I remember the question that you were discussing about is this something that is within the mix of marketing or something that is a test? It is started as a test for us, but we now see that this is something that we need to incorporate as a formal and established channel.

Yeah, that’s really interesting, Daniel. Why?

Because this is something that it started and it’s going to continue. And imagine an organization that has been doing very good job, but the same job, it’s same channels, I mean, for the last 60 years. We now know that the target audience that we need to to to get and the to talk to is in places where we are not. Instagram is really good and what we have now to try TikTok, try to metaverse. These are new channels that we need to incorporate as a formal channel now.

So, that’s very interesting. Started out as a test, but actually became a need to have because you by doing the test and getting the direct data back, realizing that actually this is a necessity to be here because if we don’t if we’re not there, they’re not seeing us essentially cuz they’re not elsewhere. Which goes back to another question I’ll have later on multi-channel approach. But before I go into that, Sarah, I would just love to understand Essence Cosmetics, Cosnova, and what but well, why did you go into virtual worlds in the first place in these emerging platforms? And then I’m going to be a bit more specific with you and go why Roblox?

Because actually there are other platforms out there like Fortnite and Zepeto, and Minecraft and Rec Room and VR Chat and even Decentraland or Sandbox. Why Roblox in particular and why virtual worlds?

So, I think with Roy and Daniel that we have something in common. It was trying to expand our reach and that’s where we are finding the new generations and that’s we are not reaching this audience through Tik Tok or Instagram. We are finding them here.

And why Roblox? I think when they I was not there when they took the decision to activate on Roblox, but back then they were looking for a place where brand values can remain without stretching it too far from stopping of being who they are as a brand and come just just adapt to something else. You know what I mean? And I think Fortnite was too far from who they are cuz what they embrace is a lot of love, kindness, tolerance and they were very scared of any kind of shooting game or something like that. I think it was not part of their personality and it’s still not part of it.

so Roblox was much more friendly allowed us also to build our own experience who with who with the identity the brand identity that we have, but also the reach the global reach of the platform was something very important for us because now the goal of the company is to go global and to become international not only being recognized as a German brand, but we we want to become a global brand and I think Roblox is there as part of our journey to have this global community too.

Okay. That’s very helpful. Well, listen, I for me it sounds like all the wise are quite similar and it’s to reach audiences. to reach audiences where you can’t reach them on traditional channels. I often when I’m thinking about wise myself and speaking with lots of different brands forgive me because I’m putting my sort of very boring data hat on. When you get down to the wide road blocks, the if reaches the objective, then you’ve simply got to look at the traffic, and Roblox has 300 million monthly active users, which is a huge amount.

And then, it starts to go down and down and down as you look at all the other virtual worlds. I mean, that is an important point. And then, I would say a second point is feasibility. I think Roblox actually offers the most feasibility in terms of what you want to do. A lot of platforms, you can do this, but you can’t do that. You can do You know, you can You can’t do items here, but you can do items there.

Whereas, I think Roblox is very smart because they’ve made it as feasible as possible. There’s a second point that I’d like to ask you all on, and this is that fun word of budget and cost. So, just going back round in the circle, I’m going to steer back round to you, Rory. How do you justify the cost of going into Roblox? I imagine in 2022, from what I’ve seen in Ten Thousand Geek, is we’ve actually seen the the barrier to entry drop as more and more developers are building for brands, and it’s become a a lot more competitive.

But, how do you justify the budgets of of going into a platform like Roblox?

Well, I think this is good if that is the case. And I think, listening to Alban talk about how this is like, an approach to Roblox or a metaverse game concept should or experience should be the same as with a social media. I think the issue with that is I can pick up my phone, start a TikTok account, and I’m creating content like straight away. It’s not The barriers to entry for, having an an authentic or you don’t not the word authentic. I don’t really like using that, but something

Yeah, and something that actually And I think, going back to your point where you were talking about, why Roblox, it’s because the people, the yes, the audience is there, but it’s the way you can speak to that audience. You know, you can do it with integrity if you really work collaboratively with the community that you’re talking to, and if you develop that team around you, and have the right partners on board that actually understand the platform, you’re not, you’re not just with social media posting things up and seeing where the views are. You’re actually kind of really on the ground, really seeing the response, seeing the chat in the like the corner where people are engaging and getting excited about what you’re doing. So, So, you just wanted to say on that point. In terms of the justification, I think it’s a real issue, and I definitely think you see it in labels in, I come from the music and entertainment background, and we had to, so, if we were if it wasn’t Elton John, we might not have been able to create something as good as we did because yes, we have an yeah, Elton has an incredible legacy that we can put on it.

It’s a real toy box of fun, and there’s such a, a broad range of music, but also the fashion items. So, there was a lot of opportunity there that connected with Roblox, but I think it’s a struggle for other artists who maybe don’t have such an established legacy or connection to the label in order to be able to justify, yeah, going onto the platform. I think that’s why you’ve seen things like Beat Galaxy from the Universal, where artists can, with a lower amount of resource, and without having to create

Yeah, so, that’s exactly it. And I think I think that’s really positive, and I think if the developer rates are reducing because they see that actually there’s even the processes have become more streamlined. I think that’s only a good thing, but I think, where you have more, you also need to make sure you’re standing out. And I think we probably would be having the same conversations if we were looking to launch an experience now as we were having, those years ago about actually what is different. Why are we doing this?

Like, is this something that the community actually is asking for? Because I think if you’re just helicoptering and going, here we are, take like this is what you’re getting, that’s not ever going to work. And I think you need to look at what your who your user base is within the experience even within that, niche demographic. Our of Okay, this is what we’re actually bringing you. And for us it was very much about finding commonalities, Elton is the king of self-expression and like Roblox users, they use their avatars to express themselves in a way that they can’t maybe in their day-to-day lives and that was such a cool thing for us to be able to find is the commonality between two probably like, if you said to many people we’re going to put Elton John Yeah, I don’t think people would necessarily go like, oh yeah, Elton Roblox, that makes total sense.

But we working really closely with Roblox, I think sorry, you made a really good point about finding a platform that connects with your brand. we had amazing conversations with the Roblox team about, them understanding their audience, us understanding Elton, how we could what what the links were and obviously Geek were key in kind of being the bonding glue between those two things. So, I’ve kind of veered off a little bit, but in terms of justification, I think you’ve just got to make sure you’ve got a really strong use case that you actually you know why you’re going on there, you know what you’re trying to achieve from it and you’re doing it in a way that’s actually got integrity, we never wanted to be the cool dad on like Roblox going on and yeah,

It could very easily be the case. It’s easy to fall into that you know. Elton is a very cool dad, but he was super cool in in Roblox. I think yeah, I think you’re raising some good points there. In my view, a lot of the conversations that we’re having is I’m a brand and I have a marketing budget for the year. And I’m going to split it between traditional media where I’m doing print, TV, radio, broadcast, and I’m doing digital with meta ads and Google AdWords, and I’m doing social media influencer marketing, you tell me how my return is going to be better in these immersive platforms than the budgets that I’m spending in these other platforms.

And that’s the key is justifying that. and where I personally think virtual worlds Well, I know virtual worlds are much stronger because we get it back in the data. It’s in that middle of funnel engagement piece. Awareness, it’s great for awareness of an audience that you can’t reach in those other platforms cuz they’re not watching TV and they’re not on social media. But really, it’s the time spent with the brand and putting a value on time spent with the brand is a challenge because that’s really, really hard.

And that’s something we’re working very hard on at Geek to value a visit, value 10 minutes with the brand versus 4 seconds with the brand in traditional social media. So, that’s that’s one key way I look at it. Daniel, I don’t I don’t know how you measure the the value of going in or justify the expense of going in in terms of [clears throat] meeting your brand objectives and in comparison to what you do on traditional social media. Is it different? Is it the same?

yes, I will answer in three parts. The first one is this is investing in innovation. This is something that is not going to go anywhere and we need to start investing in this. Even though the ROI is is larger than in other channels. And the thing is imagine that

ROI is a very tricky, tricky word, but it depends on what you see as return. But anyway, carry on.

Yes, yes, but when you measure and compare it with other channels, maybe it’s lower in this case. Yeah, but imagine investing in Facebook and in Instagram back in 2007, you know? This is something that is going to happen we need to start doing it now. So, innovation is important. The second thing is it’s not that expensive. At least in our case, the biggest investment was at the beginning when we created the whole video game, but after that continuing with the project is not that expensive, but we start getting the returns of investment when it comes to selling items or when it comes to micro donations.

So, we are expecting to have a a very good ROI along the time. And the third thing is immersive content. You know, for for for this the attention span for Gen Zs is very short. So, if and and we’re managing to have 10 minutes is is the average gaming play with a with human rights. So, how much does it cost to to to get 10 minutes of attention of a Gen Z on a topic that is important, very important or relevant for Amnesty International across the world, and especially in markets where it’s difficult for us to reach, like China, like Russia, like, so it’s really valuable for what we do.

All right. I sneezed at that. That was a very good answer. Thank you. Thank you very much, Daniel. I’ve actually, while you were talking, I was looking at a page in the report which I think is actually very valuable for those listening. When you download the report, go on to page 48 because that really helps you understand why. Are you going in for awareness? Are you going in for interest? Are you going in for conversion?

Are you going in for bottom of funnel loyalty? And based on what you’re going in for, there are different activations within virtual worlds that you should implement. And some of them cover multiple and and some of them only cover loyalty and some of them only cover awareness, but it’s really interesting to see, as I said before, most of those tests are in the middle of the funnel. And that’s where I think these virtual world platforms perform incredibly well in terms of outperforming other media channels. So, Sarah, I’m going to go on to you next in terms of how, you’ve just come off the back of a really, really successful Roblox activation.

based on all the data that you get back, and I I’m aware I I I want to be very unbiased here because I know you’re a geek user. how are you how how do you justify well, this was a success or this was not a success?

It really depends on each brand to define what are the metrics that are going to say that we are successful. In our case, at the beginning was more like the visits, then the play time session, and then later on is now monthly active users or daily active users as well. But, it really changed from the beginning. Like I mentioned, we had a previous experience, and I want to mention something. It’s so different because back then it was a campaign-driven experience.

And that it had its own success within because it was a campaign, right? It has its own achievements. But, now this time the is not a pilot any longer, it’s a long-term project. Therefore, we have other metrics to fulfill or to achieve. In our case, it became I wouldn’t I’m not say I don’t want to use the word easier because it’s not like now it’s easier to ask for budget. I don’t think it’s never is because it’s is an innovation platform, and we are still very it’s still new compared to traditional media, right?

But, I would say that the first achievements like lifetime visits and the play time session really help us to explain the executives why it’s so important. And when they saw how much time they are spending with the brand on an average, the sessions are 11 to 12 minutes. That is actually something that we don’t manage to get with scrolling on TikTok and really make them see a few seconds of us. the interactions we have within the Roblox community as well, right? Because we have a Roblox group where we actually engage in conversations with them through DMs or also the world where we are getting feedback directly to us what they like and what they didn’t like.

So, that it’s quite it’s it’s a value that cannot be measured against the traditional media.

No. And and I think being the internal champion and evangelist, you know it inherently because you’re so in the the detail of everything. But when you’re going up to explain to executives, something that’s really useful on the call for the for you brands out there, what’s really really important and Sarah said it, is you need to frame it in a way that they understand. And actually, the really important thing you said there is, well, listen, if we try to get this level of engagement in TikTok, we wouldn’t get it. But actually, play time is really important here.

And lifetime value is really really important. You try and get that in traditional social media, it’s not happening. So, actually doing a direct comparison between what you did in these virtual world platforms and what what you’re doing in social media, the only real it’s very difficult to compare a visit to a like to a view on YouTube to a a view on broadcast television. But time is something that spans across all verticals. So, time spent I think is a is a good one.

We at Geeq we’re working very hard to value that time spent because you’ve got to look at the demographic and time spent with who is very important. but I think that’s a key the key thing on justification is when you’re going to your object your C-suite to to say, “Listen, we got to keep doing this.” and you’re you’re justifying it, you’ve got to compare it to what they know, which is all the traditional verticals, and you’ve got to translate that. that’s really helpful. Thanks so much, Zara. okay.

I’d like to just ask another question, and it’s something that Alban Knights spoke about, and I’m going to leave this for the floor if anyone wants to speak about it. I did ask you all sort of why Roblox and all of that stuff. I don’t know if you noticed in the report, and I’m going to share it here so that you can see it, but one of the things that we saw is absolutely 500 brands entering virtual worlds. but 850-odd activations, which tells us that brands are activating either in one platform multiple times a year, or they’re doing this cross-platform approach where they are not, like Coach, just going into Roblox, they’re also going into Zepeto. I’m leaving it to the floor just to comment on any thoughts on the multi-platform approach.

I mean, at Roy, for example, Elton has multiple platforms on Facebook and YouTube and and Instagram. do you see a future where brand Do you think brands will take this multi-platform approach to virtual worlds as well?

Yeah, I think so. I think it’s I think similarly though, your approach has to be as I imagine most brands’ approaches with different social media channels, that you’re not replicating content, and you’re thinking specifically about what type of content performs best on that channel. I think what I found really interesting from your report was the crossover between platforms, and percentage of audience goes, but yeah, this is really interesting. And I think that shows the opportunity and the scale of, actually just because you feel you’ve done one doesn’t mean that that’s box ticked. I think the important thing is not replicating.

I wouldn’t ever want to go and do a Beyond the Yellow Brick Road V2 on another platform. I think we’d have to look at, not go back to the drawing board, but work really creatively on what actually is the next message that we’re wanting to say and how we’re wanting to connect with that audience, but no, there’s I think this is a great example of where the opportunity lies with that.

Yeah, and and just on the point, it’s fascinating because the third largest virtual world platform that brands went into was The Sandbox. Look at the percentage of The Sandbox in turn, you’ll say, “Okay, I’ve done virtual worlds because I’ve gone into The Sandbox.” You have scratched the surface in terms of the audience that’s available to you in these virtual worlds. So, from my perspective, a multi-platform approach is inevitable. It really depends on those, as you said, the authenticity, the core demographics. Do we want to go into Zepeto if we’re not interested in an Asian audience?

Then we won’t go there. but, most most brands brands are kind of global, and you have to take a multi-platform approach to to reach multiple audiences. Daniel, Sarah, do you have any thoughts or comments on on multi-platform approach?

Yes, I think this is going to happen, but first brands need to understand what are the difference between the different platforms because this is the the same like at the beginning with social media. Yes, we are in social media, but you only have one Facebook account, and you think you are in social media. You are in just one platform. So, these kind of spaces are very important, and thank you for organizing this because brands needs to know the different options that they have, the different features in each one of the platforms, and and and then comes creativity in order to to take advantage of that. So, these kind of spaces are very important.

From Cosnova is something that we have been observing how other brands are actually going across like Coach. And it’s really like my respect because they have adapted their content to each platform specifically. They are not copying and pasting like I do remember with the beginning with social media people used to copy and paste on all platforms and the content was the same. But now with Sephora for example, I do think that each platform has a very strong market. And for our brands, we need to decide, okay, we are we are also we want to become also strong in Asia.

Maybe we should start focusing on that platform as well because that’s where the audience is laying for for Sephora for example. We want to achieve the moment that we can actually be completely cross-platform, but I think obviously resources are a something that most of us we need to take into account, right? And for at least for Essence, now the time to solidify and strengthen our Roblox community and our presence in the Roblox community and then we can take over other platforms. That would be good.

Funny enough, as you were talking for this audience, this lucky audience, I’m going to immediately show them what it’s like to see the difference between one platform and the other. And I’m on the G platform right now and this is showing Sephora’s profile, Sephora’s demographics. And you can immediately look at the gender split being 72% female, 28% male. And actually the brands they’re interested in, if we go into fashion, will be totally different to this next platform I’ll show you, which is Roblox. And actually that’s more of a 50/50 split in terms of male female and a slightly younger audience.

But the brands that they are interested in are slightly different as well, and the geographic split of the platform is very different as well. So, Daniel, to your point about understanding the nuances of all these different platforms are incredibly important. I will just caveat everything by saying, it’s a bit like saying the demographics of Instagram are different to the demographics of TikTok. Well, of course they are, but actually there are profiles and influencers in TikTok and Instagram that have totally different demographics to the platform themselves, and that’s the same with Roblox. Just swap the word influencer for experience.

And that’s why we’re seeing this huge growth in terms of integrations, and that’s being very, very targeted at I, yes, I want to reach the Roblox audience, but I want to integrate into the experience that has 90% female audiences in North America. and that’s where it gets very technical and and the data gets incredibly important to be super targeted. look, I’m going to close out with one final question, and I think this is going to be the most valuable and and most important, and I’d love you guys to be as honest as you possibly can. Cuz you’ve all gone through experiences where you’re building virtual worlds, you’re working with multiple partners, you you have that day the night before where you’re pressing the launch button and you’re going, “Oh my god, I hope we’ve QA tested this and what are we missing? What are we not?” And then you’re getting the data back and you’re feeding into What’s the best piece of advice you can give other individuals and brands who are looking to integrate into these platforms?

It doesn’t have to be Roblox, it can be any other emerging virtual world platform. I’m going to start with you, Sara, in terms of all the learnings that you’ve taken from the most recent activation, what, if you could go back in time and give advice to yourself, what would that advice be?

Oh, wow. So many learnings. But, this is a platform where we are constantly learning, so it’s a never stop walk on that. But, I would say that, every brand needs to have the time to think on what is the most asset they have. In our case, in Essence Cosmetics case, was the Lush Princess, which is this character that became our NPC and guide and mentor for the players. And there is a storytelling behind. So, I think that identifying that asset first, then building your storytelling around this asset, and then living the values of the brand, also integrating part of this storytelling of this narrative that you want to communicate to your audience.

Keep it Keep it true to yourself, like Rory said. You don’t need to pretend to be somebody that you are not. You just need to embrace your values. And be there for your community, and the community will be there for you 100%.

Yeah. Thank you very much, Laura. Rory, why don’t you give us some pearls of wisdom?

Yeah, I mean, I talked about, the sort of integrity and the reasons why. I think the most important thing that we found was building the team around you. I mean, we had that team in Roblox. They were so excited, and that was just they wanted us to succeed, and that made that brilliant. Our production and development team in Sawhorse were just out of this world, amazing. and obviously Geek were brilliant to work with, and like, brought an insane amount of value.

And I think, it’s kind of, we’re a small team on my side. So, it was really important that we built that team who could deliver and who were just as excited about it as we were. I saw the opportunity and wanted to make it a a reality. and I think also just like the team doesn’t just mean the like the people who you’re you’re working with to create it. Like the creators that we work with on the platform, they were, so important like like incredibly valuable.

And the influencers outside of it, we would work on a really micro level identifying people like one person who did a tweet or a YouTube video saying that they really loved one item and then we would send them with the next release a free item and that would get them even more excited. So you’re you’re building your own community and building that team who are kind of your own advocates and influencers for yeah, a very very, from the very beginning basically. So that would be my biggest piece of advice is make

Yeah, I think that last point you said was really really important and it’s being hyper-focused not just on the big stuff. That’s kind of there’s there’s the experience looks beautiful, but actually the guy that goes in that’s really obsessive on item and then picking that up and blowing it up. that is really I mean you ended up having Elton go into the experience and with that person and the live stream

did like a walk through with a bunch of yeah, like other creators. So that was really special.

That’s where the magic happens is when you’re being very very specific and talking the language of the community and they they immediately they can pick up on it. They know. so that’s great. Daniel, what about you? Do do you have any any if you could talk to yourself before you entered, what are what are the key things that you would be telling yourself?

yes, I would say that you’re going to make mistakes and that is okay. And it’s just like with any other channel that we are trying to understand and if we are convinced that this is something that we have to do because the future is here, the present is already here, we should go ahead and try and I would say have fun, test like in anything in marketing and share whatever you learn because it’s important that other brands understand this, too.

Of course, in order to be bold, you need to accept that not everything is going to go the way you want it, I suppose. And that’s okay, especially when you’re testing and learning, that’s the point of of testing and learning. listen guys, thank you so much for joining me during this webinar. you’ve made it fantastic and you’ve given all of your real-life stories about entering these environments and I’m sure everyone listening will will be massively appreciative for for you sharing the stories. So, thank you so much.

final note from me is just I I incredibly biased from my perspective, I would say you also need to take a a data point of view, which is totally objective. and that’s going to help guide the way. so, that’s what what I would say. And just a a final on this report, it’s been expertly made by our team in marketing and they’ve done a really really great job working with our insights and client services team and there’s some real value in there. So, I’m delighted for everyone listening, you’re going to get access to that report.

Do do feel free to to to feedback to us and give us your thoughts on on some of the data that we’ve uncovered for this year. other than that, thank you for joining the webinar and we’ll see you on the next one. Thanks, everyone.